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 New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy 
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Post New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
First, some hints on how good salespeople work. I've heard people say. "You should be a salesman. You know how to talk." Nothing could be further from the truth. What a really good salesman knows is how to listen. By listening he will learn what your interests are and than lean on those things. Interested in gas mileage? He'll do his best to make his product sound like it gets the best mileage in the world short of a bicycle. Reliability? He'll tell you about people like me with 18,000 miles on the scoot. You get the idea? In the sales game that's called "pushing your hot buttons."

The next sales trick is called "putting the monkey on your back." It goes something like this. You've told him that his price is to high. He responds with, "We have to make a profit, don't we?" and than he shuts up and looks at you. He waits. He's willing to wait as long as it takes for you to say answer. Most people abhor a vacuum in the conversation and will answer just to get the conversation moving. Now he's in control.

There are two ways to deal with this ploy. The first is to just wait him out. Don't answer, just smile at him. It'll drive him crazy. The other is to reverse the game and use his tactic on him. Respond with something like, "Yes, but you don't expect to make it all on me, do you?" and shut up. See what's happened? Now the monkey is on his back. He has to answer. He's not in charge, you are. Smile and wait.

Something else he might try; "The Set Up." It works like this:
    [him] You like this scooter don't you?
    [you] Yes.
    [him] You like the color?
    [you] Yes.
    [him] You like the idea of 80 miles-per-gallon, right?
    [you] Yes.
    [him] So we're agreed that you want to own it?
    [you] Yes.
See how that worked? He got you into the habit of saying yes. Your last answer should have been, "That depends on what kind of deal we can make."

"The Closing." This is the part where he closes the sale. There are several variations so I'll just give you the most common one. "Now how do you want to pay for this scooter?" See? He's assumed the sale is made, and that now all you have to do is decide how to pay for it. If you shut him down by saying that you haven't really decided yet he'll probably fall back on "The Setup."

Now we get to what I like to call "The Rat Killin'" I call it that because it eliminates all the above sales tricks and gets right down to business.

  1. Start with the dealer with the largest inventory of Zumas.
  2. If at all possible, pay cash.
  3. Decide how much you are willing to pay to the penny. Round that number up to the nearest 50 dollars.
  4. Take that amount of cash with you and no more. (Real hard currency)
  5. Stand on the showroom floor until a salesperson comes up to you.
  6. Say, "I want that one. I will give you X amount of dollars for it out the door."
  7. He'll try to bargain. Listen politely, but just keep repeating that amount. Never waver.
  8. Let this go on for 10-15 minutes.
  9. Pull out the cash and lay it on the desk. State how much you are willing to pay one more time.
  10. Now the big trick. If he still balks pick up your money, say goodbye and try to walk out. To make this work you have to be prepared not to buy today.
  11. Go on to the next largest dealer and start the process all over again.
  12. If it doesn't work with any of them, wait 3-4 days and try again.

One more thought. Don't talk about the stuff he's going to throw into the deal until you have settled on a price. If he starts wanting to change the price by "giving" you extra stuff like a luggage box, a helmet or whatever, say, "That would be a nice gift, but I still will only give you X dollars." Remember, he gets that stuff wholesale and the mark-up is ridiculously high.

One more trick, and this one can be a lot of fun when it works. When you go to the dealership wear a new, brightly colored (in my day they were referred to as "loud") shirt. Wear a T-shirt under it. With any kind of luck the salesperson will comment on it just to start the conversation off. When he does ask if he really likes it. He'll say yes, of course. When he does immediately take it off and tell him that he can have it. Insist that he accept. Now you've given him a gift. He owes you, and knows it! It's human nature. :mmmhmm:

About the author-
Back in the 1970's I bought a home and unexpected expenses decimated my budget. I was fortunate enough to meet a fellow who was making over $60,000/year selling pots and pans. He taught me the above tricks and I was able to make $2000/month part time.

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Sun May 18, 2008 4:35 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
Very nice write up. One thing I will add is dont let them play the numbers game with you when financing. Make sure you multiply the monthly payment by the number of payments to find out what you will actually be paying for the scooter.

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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
Great write up, thanks alot. I would of saved many thousands of dollars buying vehicles, had I known the information you provided here. :riker:

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Sun May 18, 2008 5:13 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
jdubbya wrote:
Very nice write up. One thing I will add is dont let them play the numbers game with you when financing. Make sure you multiply the monthly payment by the number of payments to find out what you will actually be paying for the scooter.

By federal law they have to tell you.

Federal Truth in Lending Disclosure Statement:
The total of payments must be disclosed using that term, along with a descriptive phrase. The total of payment is the sum of the payments disclosed. Creditors may omit disclosure of the total of payments in single-payment transactions. This exception does not apply to a transaction calling for a single payment of principal combined with periodic payments of interest. In demand obligations with no alternate maturity date, the creditor may omit disclosure of payment amounts. In those transactions, the creditor need not disclose the total of payments.

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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
Oldguy wrote:
One more trick, and this one can be a lot of fun when it works. When you go to the dealership wear a new, brightly colored (in my day they were referred to as "loud") shirt. Wear a T-shirt under it. With any kind of luck the salesperson will comment on it just to start the conversation off. When he does ask if he really likes it. He'll say yes, of course. When he does immediately take it off and tell him that he can have it. Insist that he accept. Now you've given him a gift. He owes you, and knows it! It's human nature. :mmmhmm:


DAMN!! I wish I would have known this when I bought my acura and when I went to the Honda dealer to get the ruckus. Not even so much to get a better deal, but to see how they react when I try to give them my ugly bright shoes. Although the Acura dealer commented on my Ice Cream shoes so I guess I could have tried to give him the shoes for a kick, get it...shoes...kick...lulz :rudebox:

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Mon May 19, 2008 1:54 am
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
All right, I could write a really long post here since I've got a big experience buying and selling cars. I bought my '08 Zuma 2 weeks ago and the process wasn't any different. I am not going to discuss here how to buy a used vehicle, this is very different. As far as new one goes, it is easy. Although i agree with most of the guide above, I offer you a different strategy that worked for me before many many times. You do NOT need to go from dealer to dealer to get a good deal. Otherwise, you need to add to the amount of your purchase the time and gas that you spent. First, decide on which model, color, and equipment you need. Then e-mail to dealers in your area requesting a quote. Clearly state what you need (model, color, e.t.c.). Request detailed quote (price, prep fees, TTL). Ask to be contacted via e-mail (no calls). Wait a few days, take lowest quote and go pick up your scooter. Better yet, print out the lowest quote, bring it to your closest dealer, chances are they will match it. Talk about options, warranty, extras later (if you feel you need those). This is exactly what I did 2 weeks ago, after discussing final details over the phone (availability, and preparation), I walked into dealer showroom, my new scooter waiting on me all ready with "sold" sign on it. I was on my way 20 min later, honest. I paid a total of $2307 (including $120 tax, $60 title, and $20 license plates). Your price might be different because of the different market. At the time that you buy there might be possible rebates or some other specials. But at least you'll know that this is the lowest price around. Remember, when you buy a new vehicle, it doesn't matter where you buy, you'll get exactly the same product. I hope this help. I could provide tons more insight if you need to know more. Thanks.


Mon May 19, 2008 1:22 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
My way is a lot more fun though. :)

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Mon May 19, 2008 1:24 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
It might cost you a few more bucks in shirts. :)


Mon May 19, 2008 1:27 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
Very nice wright up...I especially like the rat killing part. When I go to buy something, I always have a set price in mind, and take cash with me. I always go in somewhere telling the salesmen, after they give me their speil, that the other dealer has given me a better price, so what can you do for me, and I have cash! Always Always, negotiate for an out the door price. Never the "sales" price.


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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
I used a combination of both methods Rat killin over the internet, when I showed up at the dealer he tried some more tactics so I slapped my money bag on the table and said this is the amount I can get a scooter for in beaverton out the door, we agreed in the e-mails that this price could be matched by your store, apparently somone has not been honest, he tries some more shipping assembly bla bla they have to be moved from the warehouse and then assembled, I reply great I will go pick one up in a crate, then the owner over heard and some how I got out the door at the agreed price 2401.

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Sat May 24, 2008 8:30 am
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
I'm proud of ya! :hfive:

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Sat May 24, 2008 9:40 am
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
Nice write up. :)

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Sun May 25, 2008 4:31 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
If you start getting push-back on the price, you could try what I've done in the past...

I offer a price for the car I'm interested in. Sales guy disappears for 5 minutes and comes back with his "we're close, but..." speech.

lakercr> "would you mind if I borrow your phone"?
Sales guy> "sure, be my guest" (we were sitting in his office, I'm across the desk from him).
Lakercr> (dials 411) " Hi, could I get the number to Eastern Nissan"?
Lakercr> (after being connected by DA) "Hi, could I have sales please"?
Brad> Hello, this is Brad, how can I help you"?
Lakercr> "Hi Brad, I'm sitting in an office at Nairn Nissan at the moment. I just made an offer of $x.xx to the folks here for a <insert model/series here> - doesn't sound like they can make the deal. I'm about 45 minutes away from you. Can you go check with your Sales or GM on my number? I'll be there within an hour if you guys can do the price".
Lakercr> "Sure, I'll hold".

At this point, the sales guy across from me excuses himself. Before he gets back to his office, Brad has come back on the line and said they'll do the deal at my price.

Brad comes back into the office with his manager. I tell him that Eastern wants the deal at my price, and since they've already told me that they can't do the number, could you please just go grab the check I wrote you with the offer?

Brad looks pissed, Sales MGR stumbles a bit, does a bad job of back-peddling. I grabbed my $ and went to go see Brad. I was in and out in about 45 minutes. other than trying to sell me the extended warranty ("no thanks Brad") it was a nice, clean transaction.


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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
lakercr wrote:
If you start getting push-back on the price, you could try what I've done in the past...

I offer a price for the car I'm interested in. Sales guy disappears for 5 minutes and comes back with his "we're close, but..." speech.

lakercr> "would you mind if I borrow your phone"?
Sales guy> "sure, be my guest" (we were sitting in his office, I'm across the desk from him).
Lakercr> (dials 411) " Hi, could I get the number to Eastern Nissan"?
Lakercr> (after being connected by DA) "Hi, could I have sales please"?
Brad> Hello, this is Brad, how can I help you"?
Lakercr> "Hi Brad, I'm sitting in an office at Nairn Nissan at the moment. I just made an offer of $x.xx to the folks here for a <insert model/series here> - doesn't sound like they can make the deal. I'm about 45 minutes away from you. Can you go check with your Sales or GM on my number? I'll be there within an hour if you guys can do the price".
Lakercr> "Sure, I'll hold".

At this point, the sales guy across from me excuses himself. Before he gets back to his office, Brad has come back on the line and said they'll do the deal at my price.

Brad comes back into the office with his manager. I tell him that Eastern wants the deal at my price, and since they've already told me that they can't do the number, could you please just go grab the check I wrote you with the offer?

Brad looks pissed, Sales MGR stumbles a bit, does a bad job of back-peddling. I grabbed my $ and went to go see Brad. I was in and out in about 45 minutes. other than trying to sell me the extended warranty ("no thanks Brad") it was a nice, clean transaction.


Bravo Mate! :D

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Wed Jul 02, 2008 8:26 pm
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Post Re: New Scooter Buyer FAQ by OldGuy
There are a lot of variables in car business. First, methods and strategies. Some dealers (most in fact) would like to move as many vehicles as possible while others could sit on them for months even years. Most think "volume" so they don't mind losing a few bucks on some cars if they make a lot on others. The trick is to buy the ones in the first category. It is very different with used cars as the market varies wildly. Also, if a car was traded-in, all they have to do is to sell it a bit more expensive which is mostly easy because you're definetely getting screwed when you trade it in. I've been buying and selling cars for years (not professionally). I've started like some of you with long discussions, tricks, e.t.c. I now know in 10-15 min after walking into a dealership what price I could get for that particular vehicle. And that's a max, most likely, I'll do better. Anyway, I could talk about this crap for hours. The bottom line, do your homework, know exactly what you want to buy, be firm but reasonable, don't be afraid to walk, most likely that particular car will be there tomorrow, and no it wil not get more expensive. Thanks.


Thu Jul 03, 2008 7:34 am
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